States and stages in a modified Wilber-Combs lattice

I just got an Integral Theory Conference mailer on Saturday panels. Balder will be a panelist in Third-Tier Spirituality? The question mark was in the promo, as well it should be. I seriously question third tier anything. The kennilinguists are not happy enough being on the forefront of human evolution in 2nd tier, now they are moving into 3rd tier. Jesus Mary and Joseph.

I'd like to bring in David Marshall's modified WC lattice from IL. Not because I agree with it but because it raises the right questions. He quotes Wilber from a conversation with Cohen on 3rd tier:

"Another definition of third tier is that it’s the level at which you start to permanently realize the major states of consciousness, and it just so happens that the three major stages in third tier are ones that, of necessity, objectify the subtle, then causal, then nondual states. Second-tier stages are about the highest stage structures you can get to without necessarily having some sort of state realization. And you see this a lot—people who are at an integral stage of development but don’t have a state awakening. And so one of the things that becomes really important is that in order to move into third tier and true transpersonal structures, you have to have some sort of state training and state realization."


I have my own interpretation of a modified WC lattice in our states thread. Therein I posit that indeed a more integral level has to do with integrating our states, but I don't set up the states in the same way as the lattice. I indeed have them above the formop stage on the 'ladder.' Whereas the so-called 2nd-tier stages for me are really the horizontal complexification of formop that would go lateral on the lattice at this point. And the states are actually earlier stages, the causal being that originary base awareness, then subtle the subconcsious and finally the gross being conscious. At consciousness we start getting the stages of magic, mythic, rational. Only at the rational ego can be then begin a reverse process on more fully integrating the earlier state-stages through a contemplative discipline. Hence when so doing and stablizing and integrating these prior states do we get what Wilber is calling 3rd tier. But what I'm saying is that it is really an accomplishment of the height of so-called first tier in ego rationality.

What is just the beginning of so-called 2nd tier is then having the postformal capacity to then change the interpretation to a postmetaphysical view. And that is just the beginning of so-called 2nd tier, and wherein the legitimacy battle begins for defining 2nd tier. I agree with Wilber that one can go postmetaphysical in a cognitive stage while not having the state training to integrate the prior state-stages. And that one can integrate and stabilize the state-stages while still being stuck in a metaphysical worldview stage, one of my main criticisms of most Buddhism. But one that goes postmetaphysical and integrates the states is just the very beginning of 2nd tier, not some super-advanced 3rd tier human. The latter view is just so much inflated hubris from an incorrect notion of development in the current kennilingus WC lattice.

To clarify, actually the more integrated earlier states are not above formop in a ladder sequence but just more consciously developed through state training and hence add more depth instead of height. The height or altitude aspect comes from also then having a postmetaphysical view or interpretation. Visually that would have the integrated states spiraling back down on the graph, thus providing one with a view with more breath. As I said though, the height then comes from going postmetaphysical from there. The MHC's more complex stages to me are just lateral complexification of formop and have nothing to do with this process, since I see the MHC itself (and the kennilingus extension) as still just a metaphysical view as investigated in the real/false reason thread.